Jan Kijlstra wrote in Digest 971111:

> There have been hurdy-gurdies with organ pipes (the "Drehorgel", or
> crank-organ), but they were operated by cranking the wheel, so they
> did not play automatically like a player piano or music-box.

So, do you mean a Drehorgel now or a hurdy-gurdy?  :)

I tried to start with a definition, like:  Drehorgel is a mechanical
instrument... but a hurdy-gurdy is in some way mechanical-driven too...

At a hurdy-gurdy you have to play the melody manually... well, at a
Drehorgel, too, somehow; let's say "yourself" instead of "manually"...
seems to work better.  :)

> I asked Craig Brougher if he knew of a hurdy-gurdy -- the lyra or lyre
> type, with strings, not being an organ! -- that could be played
> mechanically like a player piano or so.  He advised me to put this
> question in the MMD, so here it is.

Well, of course there are mechanical-driven lyras, but all I know are
ones with a crank _and_ a pinned-barrel (like a Drehorgel).  If you are
talking about automatic lyras, well, the piano is one.  :)

>  [ Related question:  When was a "stored program controller", e.g.,
>  [ the pinned cylinder, added to the crank-organ hurdy-gurdy?
>  [ -- Robbie

Who was talking about eggs and chicken?  Who was first: the pinned
barrel/cylinder or the hurdy-gurdy?  Which one was added to the other?

Somehow I disagree with the idea, that a pinned cylinder was added to a
crank-organ hurdy-gurdy.  I prefer the idea of the crank-driven pinned
cylinder being added to a little church-organ (the little daughter...).

In my opinion, to find out which way it really has been goes to nowhere.
There been lots of people (also still living ones) who said:  "I invented
the barrel-organ."

greetings by(e) Ingmar Krause

ERlanger drehORGEL-Trio, Familie Krause, erorgelt@balloon.franken.de

 [ I still believe that the mechanical-violin hurdy-gurdy appeared
 [ two- or three-hundred years before the crank-organ hurdy-gurdy
 [ was developed.  -- Robbie